The Joe Rogan Experience - #2142 - Christopher Dunn
Episode Date: April 30, 2024Christopher Dunn is the author of several books, including "Giza: The Tesla Connection," "Lost Technologies of Ancient Egypt," and "The Giza Power Plant." www.gizapower.com Learn more about your ad ch...oices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
Transcript
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The Joe Rogan Experience.
Trained by day, Joe Rogan podcast by night, all day.
All right.
Thanks for doing this, sir.
I appreciate it.
Oh, you're welcome.
I've enjoyed many of your videos online, so I'm fascinated by these theories that you
have.
Oh, that's one.
So I'm excited.
I'm excited I'm excited
that you're here could you please first of all could you tell everybody what
your background is like what did what did you start off doing
professionally I started as an apprentice in a engineering company in
Manchester England and worked through the apprenticeship, received my journeyman
papers, worked for a couple more years in England and then I was recruited by an
aerospace company in America and emigrated to America. And what did you do
for this aerospace company? Well I started out as a lathe turner, that was my specialty.
A what? A lathe turner. A lathe turner. Yeah. Yeah. Right, so I was a lathe hand, right.
So I operated, you know, horizontal lathes, vertical lathes. In England, you know, they
had what they call them vertical boring mills. And In the States you have to learn a different language right there.
The cultural differences between, right?
So you pick up different terminologies for things.
Like they call over here, they call it a vertical turret lathe.
In England they call it a vertical boring mill. Mm. And so you're working with machines and when did you come up with this theory about
the pyramid?
Well, actually I had been in the States for a while. I came over in 1969 and in 1977, I picked up Peter Tompkins' book, Secrets of the Great Pyramid, and I started
to examine that book.
And one of the things that Tompkins, he asked a very significant question in that book,
and he said, does the Great Pyramid enthrine a lost science?
You know, is the Great Pyramid a product of that science? Does it reflect that
science? And I took that question very seriously. And that question was in my mind as I read
through the book. And then I started to explore some of the references that he provided in bibliography. One of them was the work of William Flinders Petrie.
And he described lathes being used in ancient Egypt. He described very large coring drills up to 18 inches in diameter.
And he also claimed that they were using circular saws.
When he's describing this,
like what kind of metal would they be using?
Well, that's the thing.
The question really demands that you explore all methods that you are able to, when you
satisfy the historical record, say the archaeological record, and you say, okay, I'm going to try
this.
Well, that's not going to work. That won't work, I'm gonna try this. Well, that's not gonna work. That
won't work. So we'll try this. We'll keep improving our methods and tools until we arrive
at a solution to explaining the artifact. That's the important thing. That's basically
the demands on a manufacturing engineer,
which I eventually became. So, you know, if a customer comes in and they bring a part
to the company and said, I want you to make one just like this. What does the, what do
we do? Well, we have to know what this is. And to do that, you take measurements,
you determine materials, how it was manufactured, you look for tool marks to see what processes
may have been involved in it, whether there were dyes, whether there's machining marks in areas, you look at the welds, did they weld some
parts, did they braze other parts, and then of course the geometries. And basically that's
your model, that's like, okay, I've got to make something just like this.
Right, but when you're making something, like if you're looking at say some of the stone work
that was done in the pyramid where there's, not in the pyramid, but in some of the quarries
where you see these core drill holes.
Right.
Like, how would you reverse engineer that?
Like how would you figure out what could possibly do that?
Well, that's the interesting question. It's one that's been a huge debate going on about
that. It really goes back to 1984. I had published an article called Advanced Machining in ancient Egypt? Question mark. And it was published in Analog Science Fiction
Science Fact Magazine in August of 1984.
So you've been at this a long time.
It's, yeah.
Is that before you were born?
I was in high school.
Yeah, you were.
Yeah, I was a junior in high school.
I wasn't.
So it was, and you you know Stanley Schmert, Dr. Stanley Schmert who's the
editor of Analog, a very respected editor selected it for publication and
we went through you know the editorial processes, suggested changes and stuff
like that and and then it was it went out And so what did you when you look at like the core the drill holes the vases are another like very
fascinating and
Real gigantic mystery how those were constructed and we'll talk about those as well
You want to give me is that what it looks like that's a model of one
And but the core holes itself, we had a debate recently
with Graham Hancock and Flint Dibble.
And one of the things that Dibble had suggested
was that they had done something with sand,
and that that was how they were able to do this,
with copper and sand, and they were able to drill.
Does that make sense to you?
Well, I mean, I've heard that, that theory about how they were done.
And I know that there has been work done to prove that that theory is the correct one.
But central to explaining at the actual core, if you go back and you read Petrie, he described a spiral
groove around a granite core and he said that it had like a pitch of 100,000s per revolution
of the drill. And so that's what I was going on when I claimed, well, what kind of a process
would you need to... Can I stop you there? When you say a pitch of a thousandth per...
Yeah, for every revolution of the drill, it sinks into the granite a hundred thousandths of an inch.
Okay. So because of that, you know that this thing has to be
operating at a certain speed? Not necessarily rotational speed, but the penetration rate. So
which each with each rotation it will go how long? How far? A hundred thousandths of an inch, which
is almost a one-eighth of an inch. So that's pretty impressive when you're talking about solid granite, correct?
Yeah.
And that probably wouldn't be possible with copper and sand?
No.
It seems like sand and copper just are not abrasive enough.
No, I contacted a company that specialized in drilling granite and I asked them how many, what is
the feed rate, that one hundred thousandth of an inch would be the feed rate of the drill.
What is the feed rate of your drills when you're drilling into granite. And I got a response from him and he said, generally, you know, our drills,
they're diamond. They rotate around 900 revolutions per minute and the penetration rate is about of an inch per revolution so two tenths of an it to ten thousandths of an inch
per revolution oh two ten thousand to ten thousand I'm sorry yeah I misspoke so
two ten thousandths of an inch is like 500 times smaller than 100,000.
Wow, so these drills that they used in Egypt were capable of drilling, with each revolution,
500 times more than modern diamond drills that were used by people who cut into granite.
Their penetration rate was 500 times greater. So it might have been operating a slower revolution,
but when it's going through its full revolution,
it's much more effective.
That's what I concluded in my article.
Now is this in, sorry,
but is this in multiple different drill holes,
or is it one individual sample that they found
that seems to operate at this depth per revolution?
There have been inspections on several different cores.
And if they all yielded similar results?
And they have all revealed that the groove is a spiral.
In other words, it's a continuous spiral around the core.
The most recent examination of those cores was in 2018 by two aerospace engineers, Eric Wilson and Josh Gere. And they asked the Petrie Museum in London permission
to examine the cores in their collection.
The Petrie Core number seven which is the most famous core
and the one that has drawn the most heated kind of debate about.
Can we see what that looks like?
Jamie can you find that one?
Petri core number seven it's on that
Because this to me and the vases obviously and of course the construction the pyramid itself, right?
There also the symmetry of the faces. There's so many things that are so mind-blowing about
whatever they did and how they did it. Forget about all the mysteries. Just what we know
in terms of, okay, so these are these two core samples. These are these two cores. No, they're the same one and they're from
lost technologies of ancient Egypt and essentially what happened was the there
was a book written I think it was in 1999 it was by Chris Olgove Harold and
Ian Lawson and it's called Geese of the truth And so what they did is they had contacted or they had
Associates that went into the feature museum and examined the core
To see if it was actually a spiral
So they took photographs of it and they examined this and they examined those photographs and they said no they're horizontal now
There's a big difference when you talk about a horizontal groove right and a spiral groove and so I was like okay I
suspend all assertions as far as the methods that I proposed for how it may
have been done I need to go and examine that item myself.
And so I booked a flight to England and a friend of mine in Cambridge picked me up at
the airport, Nick Annis, and we went to the Peetcher Museum and I examined the core. The method I used was to just wrap a simple cotton
thread around it.
So you just followed the groove with the thread?
With the thread. But I was wearing rubber gloves. Well, yes, I was wearing rubber gloves, but I was also wearing a visor with
Lenses in it that gave ten times. Oh, okay. So you can really see where the groove yeah
Yeah, you you would find you would find uh, find those items in any tool tool makers box
So if the lines were horizontal you would go around in a circle
Then you'd have to cross over the ridge to hit to the next circle
Yeah, but in this, it was continuous.
No, I mean, it was continuous.
So how did they miss that?
That seems like this is such an important piece of history, such a fascinating thing
to examine.
Look at this mystery.
You have this granite core.
How do they do it?
There's lines on it.
Are they horizontal or are they a spiral? And then they just go it's horizontal with and then you come along with string and you're like no
It's a spiral right like how did how does someone screw that up? Yes. I mean they would say
That I screwed it up obviously
But the thing is Joe is that you know when you're conducting research anybody whether you're a scientist or just a you know
Joe blow in the tool room and you are you say okay this is what I found and
these are the methods I used and these are the results okay.
So you set you describe your experiment you lay it out and you explain in detail how you
did it.
Wouldn't with today's technology wouldn't it be really easy to scan it?
Well, it is now, yeah.
And then they would, so have they done that?
Have they definitively proven one way or the other?
I don't think there is a really high quality scan that would be necessary.
I mean, I've learned a little bit about scanning. It was just being
introduced into manufacturing when I retired, just before I retired. We started to look
into it and we bought this white light scanning system. But now...
The systems now are so advanced the systems now and you
would feed it through AI and it would tell you exactly well you yeah I mean
you basically you would you could you could slice it dice examine it any way
you wish but you need to have qualified people to do it. Not anybody that's not
qualified could examine that. Right. So either way, these cores and
those drill holes represent something sensational, something absolutely amazing.
Some 4,500 year old drill that somehow or another was more effective
than drills that are being used today. Yeah, but you know the truth of
the matter Donald Joe? What? It's probably the most insignificant artifact I've looked at.
I'm sure. You've looked at so much in Egypt. Yeah. But to me it's like a corner piece. Oh,
people are freaking out over it. Yeah. How could you? How dare you? Well, I'm sure because it
throws everything into flux.
Because how did they, the assumption
is they did this through intense labor over long periods of time,
and it took forever to do.
And if they're operating at a pace that's
500 times more effective than a drill that's
used by a modern, have you talked to other people
that go into
granite? Are there more sophisticated drills that work better or more
powerful drills that work better than his? You know that the thing is in
manufacturing and this is a fact. You don't know the full scope of
what engineers are capable of doing.
Right.
Because you're not in every shop, in every country, in every town in the world.
And so nobody knows exactly what all engineers are capable of.
There may be somebody actually reproducing the features
on that course somewhere using some method.
I don't know, you just don't know.
But from the person that you talked to
that does it professionally, that uses high level equipment,
his drill was 500 times less effective.
It was, the feed rate was less.
The revolution could have been
more. I mean you said it earlier. I said could it be I've been rotating slowly.
Right. It didn't have to spin very fast. In fact it's better when you're machining
hard material or grinding hard material is that you don't. Why? Because heat. Heat
is the biggest enemy of a tool. Oh, that makes sense. Yeah, that
makes sense. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So what do you think if you had to guess that they were
using? I actually created my own core just to experiment, right? And I learned a lot
doing it. I didn't use the same method as some of the other researchers
that are out there that did it.
I had a copper tube and I had corundum.
What's corundum?
Oh, I say a very, very hard grit
that you used to grind into hard material.
So the copper tube would be flat at the bottom
and then you'd put the grid in the grid would act as
Right, right. And so you'd rotate it, rotate it, rotate it.
You know, I set up a jig and a tube and just ground it,
ground it, ground it, ground it, just so that I could see the results of that.
But one thing, they say that copper was the only metal that was available to the ancient
Egyptians, but when it came to knocking out the core from the hole, I tried copper and
it wouldn't budge it, so I had to use a steel chisel.
Is it possible that they use something else like heat?
You know I'm actually leaning more towards that because of the the difference in the finish.
Like if they poured boiling water in it or something would that loosen things? I don't
think water would be it but the uh if you compare the difference in the finish, I'm sorry, what did you mean by that?
Yeah, that I don't think has been discussed enough or recognized to be important enough
is that when you use an abrasive like sand or like emery or anything to grind out a hole
or do whatever, you leave a sanded finish naturally polished not polished sanded sanded smoother
Is that which it could be smooth, but it's definitely got a sanded finish
And what is the difference you're a sanded finish and the finish of a diamond bit?
Well, we don't we don't know if they were using the diamond bit, but that's what they do today
Right, that's what they do today. That's what they do today.
So what is the difference between a sanded finish?
Well, you still have the same thing.
You're using an abrasive.
You're keeping the abrasive as cool as possible as you're grinding away, but you're still
grinding it.
And so your finish is not going to be polished unless you have a
secondary process where you go in and polish it with a finer grit. You
don't start with a very very fine grit because you won't get anywhere with it.
Let's take a look at some of those holes. Jimmy can you show us some of those
holes the drill holes in granite in ancient Egypt so here we could see right
here which is absolutely wild. Some of these images I mean that is absolutely wild right I
mean how the hell did they do that well that's what just about this is like an
engineer's playground they go through there right and you for as an engineer
you must be just like scratching your head yeah yeah fascinating stuff. Yeah, definitely. Jamie, click on that.
Well, yeah, there we go.
That's a good one.
I mean, that one's wild.
That is just absolutely crazy.
That is it.
It looks like it's at Abu Ghraib and it's in an alabaster.
Have you ever measured the circumference of these things?
No.
Have you measured the diameters?
Have you measured whether or not they're equal
circles? Well, they are definitely round. They're perfect? Yeah. Perfectly round? I
wouldn't say perfect, no. So absolutely a drill was used. You can't say perfect. Right,
right, right. Of course. No such thing as perfect. Right. But they're round. Close
enough too. And so these, wow, look at that. That is amazing so these circle circular holes
were definitely cut by some kind of a drill that's agreed upon yeah okay yeah
so if you couldn't do it with the copper like when you tried to do with copper
how long did it take and how much how much results did you get circular marks
man that is crazy there's a few days that spiral right? There's absolutely nuts. Hmm
I mean just clearly looks like a drill hole. Yeah, I think that's my photograph. I took that one
So how long did it take you to drill a hole?
Probably
Day and a half two days day and a half, two days.
Day and a half, two days, and how deep was the hole?
The hole was probably two inches, two and a half inches deep.
Well, that seems like it's doable then, right?
If you could just keep doing it day after day, week after week,
you'd get a big core.
Yeah, and that's basically what everybody concludes, the Egyptologists will conclude, that they
had all the time in the world to do these things.
But wasn't the pyramid of Giza, the Great Pyramid, wasn't that supposed to be completed
inside of 30 years in that hypothesis?
I've heard anything between 10 years and 100 years.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I've nobody.
It's just guesswork, right?
Yeah.
I mean, there's what is it?
2,300,000 stones.
Right.
And the heaviest ones in the base like what are the heaviest ones?
Well, the ones that we know of in the Great Pyramid weigh up to 70 tons and those are the granite
ones in the King's Chamber.
So there's that.
So there's the drill holes, which are just absolutely fascinating, and then this pottery
we'll talk about before we get to the hole, what you think the pyramid is.
So the pottery, like these vases that you're seeing, I shouldn't
say pottery. No, they're not pottery.
I'm wrong. I'm wrong. They're actually solid carved.
Right. And they're carved out of very hard stone,
right? What is it they're carved out of? Oh, granite, diorite, bivalve.
And... Ignis Rock.
And the crazy thing is how well they're done. And if you show it, could you pick that thing up
to show everybody?
The crazy thing is that it's not only perfectly symmetrical,
again, don't use the word perfect, right?
Because it's within what width of a human hair?
Well, you got, it's some crazy.
Yeah, like two and a half thousandths or something like that.
Two and a half thousandths of a human hair.
Have you ever used one of these
Yes, I have. All right, so measure
Measure the lip there right see that. Yes, sir measure that and then turn it 90 degrees and measure
Okay, this obviously is not a real one. You wouldn't be let me hold. No that is actually a 3d print
Right 3d print from the STL. Right, but it's not a real one. No, obviously not. Okay.
But it's a copy of the original.
Right.
And so...
So basically...
So I'm measuring it here, and then I'm going to measure it here.
So it's essentially exactly the same everywhere, right?
Is that the idea?
It's within about a thousand, thousand and a half.
It's got a little bit of a chip in the top.
Yeah, well, you don't... Because that's how a little bit of a chip in the top. Yeah, well you don't.
Because that's how it was, right?
Don't measure that.
And so it's perfect, except up to what percent
of your human hair again?
I would say in shop talk it's perfect.
In shop talk it's perfect.
Yeah, but it's, yeah, a human hair,
two and a half thousand, three thousand.
So this is how you measured it all with this equipment. Well, two and a half thousand, three thousand.
So this is how you measured this equipment.
Well this was a different...
But the thing is, it's like you couldn't spin this on a potter's wheel.
This is where it gets really crazy.
Because of these handles.
Now these handles are also carved into the vase.
People would say, what's the big deal about a vase?
The big deal is these goddamn handles. That's a big deal. Because even if you just slowly
and meticulously with the finest of craftsmanship spun this to a perfect
accuracy just with like high grit sandpaper or you know where it's slowly
over time made it perfectly round and you got so good at it that you get it within, how much of a human hair again?
About a human hair.
Okay. Two and a half though.
Okay, let's say it's a human hair, which is pretty small.
How the hell are you gonna do these handles?
How are you gonna make these perfect too?
There's another question that you need to ask too.
How do you get the inside out?
No. What?
How do you measure it to be sure
that you're within that human hair? Right. What kind of equipment are you using? What kind of instruments do you use?
Yeah, it seems like this would be a problem. Like, I don't think they had this.
And if they did have this, they didn't have this part. How do you know? I don't
know. I'm guessing. I don't know either. No. No. But we're thinking about what
they had. We're not thinking about things like this. But we don't. We I don't know either. No, no, but we're thinking about what they had.
We're not thinking about things like this, but we don't we really don't know.
Obviously we don't know if we can't locate that drill.
If you can't locate that drill, like the drill's real, the hole's real. If you can't locate an ancient Egyptian drill,
so there's a bunch of pieces of pottery. Yeah. And all of them have the same sort of similar measurement to them in
terms of their perfection?
Actually, some of them, there's one I think is more precise than that one.
Really?
The original, yeah. They call it the spinner. I think it's that one at the front there. And we rotated that on the rotap
at Danville Metal Stamping,
and we staged it so that we were checking
concentricity or run out all around.
So we put an indicator in various places
and then spun the rotary table to check the run out.
And that thing, that one spinner vase blew me away.
You know, when you have a,
when you're measuring a diameter, right,
just a straight diameter,
and you're checking the run out on a straight diameter,
and you know, you have it on a straight diameter and you know you have
it okay that's within 2000. You only have that one axis that is actually
affecting the movement of that indicator that you're using. On this bowl, when
you're on the side of it on the crown not right to the top, but just below it
You're at a place where the movement in two axes
Two axes is affecting the indicator reading
So any error that you have vertically or horizontally they meet at the top
Yeah, it's gonna is're going to get an accumulation of error in run out.
And how accurate is that one, the spinner?
It's probably within a thousand and a half.
What does that mean?
A thousand, about half the thickness of a human hair. Half the thickness of a human hair.
Half the thickness of a human hair.
And one of the vases that's incredibly impressive is there's one with a longer neck and a lip
on the top and then it bowls out of the bottom.
Yeah.
And it's again all carved out of granite somehow.
Right.
And how?
What did they do to do that? Well that's the thing. I think
we're kind of... There's some other ones, Jamie. There's one of them that has like a
longer neck. See if you can find it online maybe. Yeah, there seems to be... we seem to
be stuck in a time warp where we're trying to come to terms with how the pyramids were built, with how all these artifacts
were built.
Oh, okay.
That's a nice posh cup.
Can I keep that?
Yes, sir.
It's all yours.
Cheers, mate.
Thank you for being here.
All right.
So, continue.
So, we're lost in history.
So, yeah. continue? So we're lost in history. So yeah, I mean, so we
have competing forces, we've got on one side, you have practical
engineers, practical scientists, and they want to they want to
measure everything exactly and regardless of what current theories prescribe how they were made they want to explore other methods. However on the
other side on the side of scientists, I mean, not engineers, archaeologists or
Egyptologists, they believe that if you're examining an ancient artifact
and you're a modern engineer that you have to work under the guidance of an
archaeologist or an Egyptologist, Otherwise your work is not, would
not be recognized. That's weird. And that's, and that is happening. I mean that's the fact. And they
admit it. So that is, that is the situation. They say I think it's a systemic problem because it is certainly not a way to
Do science well and also they're not educated in those disciplines suppose. Oh bingo. Yes
I mean, so they wouldn't be able to understand what's required to do that
Now what the conventional explanation being some sort of copper and sand if that's the conventional explanation
There's no evidence of any copper
drills, correct
If you go to the
Cairo Museum they have a I think there's a tube that they describe a small tube that they describe as a
But nothing that something like carved those large. No, large holes out of grit.
Yeah, they're just going on the assumption that only copper existed during that period,
and so that was the metal that was available to them.
That was the metal that they used.
The tubes that they have in the museum, are these tubes authentic tubes that were used
on the site for something?
I would have to go back and refresh my memory on that because it was quite a while before
I looked at it.
But the point is like they don't, you know, like they have a replica of an ancient boat.
They know the boats, they know what the boats look like.
They don't have the actual drill.
So whether it's something exotic that we didn't know that they had capability to create,
or whether it's what they think it is, neither one of those exist.
They don't exist.
Okay.
No, I mean, nothing exists.
Everything right now is theory.
And so we're stuck in a bit of a time walk, and we're stuck, it's between two disciplines.
So what is the reluctance of the
archaeologists to accept the findings of the engineers if the goal is the truth?
So if the goal is to figure out instead of just having assumptions that you're
going to cling to as dogma as to what was done, wouldn't the goal be let's find
out what the truth is what's capable of doing this if they
talk to enough engineers and especially enough people that actually carve into
granite right then you would get an understanding of what we know today
this is the only thing that can do this this is how it's possible yeah and then
you would try and reproduce the artifacts of the ancient Egyptians
produced right and then compare the results right? That's what you have to do you have to
so the reluctance is they
Don't believe that the Egyptians had any more advanced
technology than what we assume they had which is pulleys and ropes and
Copper tools and sand and the like yeah one would one would assume that you'd have to ask an
Egyptologist and you may get a different answer depending on who you ask.
I'm sure.
I'm sure.
There's probably a lot more open-minded people coming up now.
Yes, particularly in Egypt.
Yeah.
Yeah, there's a tremendous kind of quiet revolution going on in Egypt because you go where you feel like you're gonna be welcomed you know
if you're not welcome somewhere you find someone so when I was when I put my
work out and I was talking to people in the 90s on message boards and I could
see that you know I wasn't getting anywhere there. And I thought, well, okay, who has the most to gain and who has the most to lose by opening
this up and exposing everything, right, and getting it out in the open?
Who has the most to gain if they come down on my side and who has the most to lose?
And obviously, those who have the most to lose are the Western institutions
who have written the history of the world, have written the history of Egypt. And so
I decided, well, I have to appeal to Egyptian engineers. And so in my second book, Lost
Technologies of Ancient Egypt, I appeal, I put out a challenge to modern Egyptian engineers to go out and check the artifacts for themselves.
And that's what they did.
One man, one engineer, I don't know how many other engineers were involved, but I've also But also I'm talking to Egyptologists tour guides and the message I'm getting is that
the pyramid of tomb theory is pretty much on the way out.
The young people are being energized and looking at their artifacts in a different way. So the engineer that I
took up the challenge is called Ahmed Adley and he followed my path.
He went into the Serapium and checked those huge granite boxes. He did a study
of the statues. He presented the Giza power plant theory to a
physicist at Cairo University. And it's like, wow, times are changing. So the Egyptian youth
are taking all of the reins and they're excited about their future. You
know just recently there was a there was a there's like a STEM class it was put
on by Nama American University. It was held at the Grand Egyptian Museum, and there were over 200 students that took
place.
And the professors and teachers of these students got amadadly involved to design experiments, to talk about pyramids as energy sources, talk
about the statues, symmetry, design projects that the kids could do, and even
even to the point of taking a slab of copper and trying to cut a brick using the old method just so that
they could get a hands-on feel for what it was like.
It's all very well to sit at home in your armchair and come up with a theory, but if
you don't go out and test it, then you you know you know are you just going to buy it rope that right okay
okay I respected respected professor tells me that this this was done with
copper copper chisels a couple slabs and it's well if he says it then he's got to
be right because that's what he's paid for. He's paid to teach the truth. What is the oldest known iron that we are aware of? Oh, in terms of steel?
Yeah, that's a little outside my wheelhouse. I don't know. I won't be able
to answer that accurately. Right, but they don't think that the Egyptians had it. Well, there was metal iron found in the Great Pyramid. There was? Yeah. I think it
was during Peter's time, an engineer called Perring discovered an iron plate
that was lodged near one of the shafts.
Wasn't there also, didn't one of the pharaohs
have a dagger that was made from a meteorite?
Supposedly, yeah, a meteorite iron, yeah.
Okay, so.
So how old is that, I don't know.
And really, when you talk about the smelting of iron,
you know, I mean, I think you had that discussion on
with your when Graham and did we talk about that?
Jimmy, like when and the other smelting being, it could have been, though, but let's find
out what is the conventional date that they use today for the smelting of iron when they
start doing that. I think the discussion was the appearance of lead in these ice cores that were drilled.
Oh, that's right.
Right.
Industrial activity, basically, what they were looking for.
So 1200 BC.
Okay, the history of...
Feraus?
How do you say that word?
Pharaohs.
Pharaohs metallurgy began far back in prehistory, most likely with the use of iron from meteors.
There you go. The smelting of iron bloomaries, is that it? Bloomaries, is that what you said?
Began in the 12th century BC in India, Anatolia or the Caucasusus iron use in smelting and forging for tools appeared in sub-saharan Africa by
1200 BC so
It could be that these pharaohs that the one that had the iron
Dagger made out of a meteorite. Maybe that was later. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, two-ton common. Okay, so for sure
It was look at that meteoric iron dagger
Wow, so that's 1334 to 1325 BC
Interesting. Mm-hmm. Well, that's earlier
That's earlier than they said people were smelting
Yeah, but that's different but that but if it's two ton common that's his time
Yeah, but that iron came from outer space.
Right, so they could have hammered it into that position, so they didn't have to smelt it.
So we know they're aware of it, at least at this, at 1300 BC.
We know they're aware of iron, but there's just no evidence of tools. Yeah, I mean I can't, I wouldn't, I wouldn't, I don't know if they knew what the metallurgy
of these materials that they had found but they had a material that they could shape
and they shaped it into a dagger.
But we don't know if they shaped it into tools or shaped it into some other things.
This piece says that the iron plate right here says it was unlikely that it was a byproduct
of copper smelting operations.
It was badly corroded.
The outer layer of the iron had been badly corroded and now forms banded iron oxide.
Significant proportions of gold were found in one of the oxidized layers and the plate
may originally have been gold plated.
New data coupled with the original archaeological
information strongly suggest the iron plate is contemporary
with the building of the pyramid and that it is therefore
one of the oldest known pieces of iron.
Yeah, I think Petrie described it as having
pneumolites that had somehow been deposited on the surface.
So at least that's some evidence of iron in the Great Pyramid.
But, you know, as far as what iron was it smelted.
Right. And that's the question.
Did they have the capability of doing that?
And when?
Right. And when?
Right.
Right. So it's just pure speculation as to what they used for the core.
What is the conventional thought as to how they made these vases?
I mean there are demonstrations of crafting ancient vases.
But I think this recent research and the discovery of the precision of them, which had always
been a question mark until just recently.
People would go through the Cairo Museum or any museum in the world and they would see
these beautiful, finely crafted artifacts made out of igigness rock and they look extraordinarily
precise and I've done that the same the same I mean I look at them and I was
like wow I'd like to get one of those in my shop and just check it out you know
quality inspection and and so for years that was that a, for me, it was like always a question. I love to know how precise those vases are.
And then in 2018,
the owner of that original vase, Adam Young,
he came on the tour and he befriended my son Alex
and they were talking about the vases
and Alex was a quality inspector, quality engineer, to the company that I worked at.
Since he worked at another company in Indianapolis and now I think he's working in the metrology
lab at Rolls-Royce in Indianapolis and now I think he's a working in the metrology lab at Rolls
Royce in Indianapolis and so he's like well we should scan them or do it do an
inspection. So Adam brought his vase down to Indianapolis and to where
Alex was working and he got permission from the managers at the shop to do an
inspection of them.
And it seems like, you know, you talk to people, shop people, right? People who are
actually out there every day making quality parts that people, people's lives
depend on. You know, if you fly on an airplane and you, and I told one of the
owners, there's another owner of Vase, he's got a
lot of them and I told him I said
you know you're carrying in your hand an
artifact that is more precise than some
of the parts that were installed in the
engine that was on the plane that you
flew in. And he's like, wow.
Okay.
I mean, that's where you bring it home.
And so all these guys who are making these artifacts, right, and they're held to exacting
standards every day.
They can't slip up.
They can't make mistakes.
You know, there's no fudging or faking anything.
Otherwise, you'd be out on your ear ear or people would be falling out the skies.
What do you, right?
So that's for those parts, and these artifacts
are more precise than that, which is just insane.
Well, not all of them.
I mean, there are parts in an airplane engine
or aircraft engine that are more precise.
Or features, features of the parts are more precise.
And that's where, and could I,
I wanna explain something here
because I think it's a very, very important point.
And it has confused a lot of people.
Really confused a lot of people.
Any part that you have, it's a something for your
car you know say a crankshaft or something like that right take a
crankshaft it's got very precise features on it and then there are
features that are not so precise because
this don't they don't need to be it all depends on what the customer requirements
are so they don't they don't build precision or or require precision in a
product where it's not needed that's's just waste of time. It just makes it more expensive.
But now you have people who are looking at some of these artifacts like the boxes in
the Serapium and they're finding imprecise areas of the boxes. The photograph of me inside
imprecise areas of the boxes the photograph of me inside one of those boxes where they really toolmakers precision square I mean there's nothing
nothing simpler right you take a square you stick it out and you look you check
check to see if the if it's square, are the surfaces flat, is it square?
Yeah, that's fine.
And now you've got guys going around on the outside of the box and finding inaccuracies,
some areas inside boxes that have inaccuracies.
And now they're calling me a liar.
They say that I faked and fudged measurements.
Right? It's like, I don't
know, the council culture they want to get away from.
What is their beef? Like, you used a square and you measured things and you found them
to be precise.
And I said, holy shit, look at this.
And what are they using?
Before me. holy shit look at this and what are they using before before me what equipment
are they using that's showing that your equipment would that what your
measurements are were inaccurate they are not they don't they don't go to the
area and show that the area that I was checking is imprecise, they will find some other area that is less
precise, point to that and lead the viewer to believe that that defines
everything. Right, so everything is not precise but much of it is? Yes. Okay. Yeah.
And the areas that aren't necessary to be precise, like the outside of the box, are
not as precise as the inside.
Is that what you're saying?
They don't have to be.
Right, they don't have to be.
So when it comes to precision, like the precision of the faces, for instance, and some of the
sculptures, what is the conventional explanation for how precise they are?
Because these are massive faces
that were supposedly carved by hand,
but the accuracy on either side of the face
is so phenomenal.
Bizarrely so, like how accurate?
Well, exactly.
We don't know. But I mean, as far as the the methods that I use, which is like 2D photography, and some geometric features. Nobody had done that before. And
so I come along, you know, I said, wow, this is actually, it kind of hit me. It was the first
time I went to Egypt and I was at Saqqara. I was looking down the length of the statue of
Ramsey's at the Open Air Museum there. And they said, well, those nostrils are extraordinarily
symmetrical.
I mean, they match, right?
And most people's nostrils are different,
if you look at them.
And so the, yeah, that's my photograph.
There's the measurements on each side.
They're exact.
Yeah, they're as exact as I could make it.
But, you know, I qualify the work that I did by saying, this is not the final answer.
There needs to be more sophisticated measurements taken, more accurate
measurements taken. They need to be scanned and then they need to be
analyzed where you have a precise scan where you're not you know you're not
trusting your eyes. You're actually trusting, you know, the tried and true development of laser scanners.
But at the very least, the amount of symmetry that exists in these massive statues is spectacular.
It's mind-blowing. I can't even express it. It's absolutely mind-blowing. I mean, you
look at the one with the...
How large are these that we're talking about?
Well, the one that I measured was... the first one was at the Luxor Museum and it's outside.
I would say it's probably about four feet or something.
But there's very large ones too, right?
Just the face, like the face and the headdress.
There are larger ones, yes.
The, I think the one that was taken from the Ramesseum
and is now in the British Museum was a large statue.
How big was that? John McDonough I think, well, they say that the statues
at the Aramaicium weigh up to a thousand tons?
I'm not sure.
But they're really big, really big.
Trevor Burrus A thousand tons.
Look at that.
John McDonough Well, I wouldn't say, yeah, a thousand tons.
But I would say they
were extremely heavy. Now what is the conventional speculation as to how the
symmetry was achieved? I've heard different ideas where you take a mirror
and then you kind of match it to you know when you guide your hand and another one where you you take a
pointer and you set a depth and then you transfer that from one side and those
are you know I mean I I don't know anybody who is a, you know, a precision manufacturer who would accept such
an explanation.
And really, at the end of the day, you have to say, okay, well, show me, and we'll match,
you know, show me, and we'll check yours and compare it to the original. That's the only way to solve the problem.
And so this is just one example of one of the mind-blowing mysteries involved in this
culture that they had some kind of capability of not just doing that and not just making
the vases but also making the pyramids themselves.
Yes.
Which are beyond comprehension.
It's huge. I mean, you know, the thing is that you have, I don't think, I wouldn't say,
not all engineers think alike, right? But I've never been with an engineer who has examined this subject and been to Egypt that is not absolutely blown
away by what they're seeing. And they're saying, no, you can't do it by hand. You can't hold
those kinds of tolerances by hand. You look at the Ramsey statue and you look at the symmetry,
it's not two dimensional symmetry.
I mean, I was just measuring a two dimensional photograph.
It's not two dimensional, it's three dimensional.
So that radius that you see going around the jawline
is moving in three axes, right?
X, Y, Z.
And you're still coming up with a
radius perfect radius crazy
nuts Yeah
and
So let's go to the pyramid itself. So you have a very fascinating
hypothesis as to what the pyramid or theory as to what the pyramid actually was and
or theory as to what the pyramid actually was. And it's based on where the supposed King's chamber is, where those passages go through into it, and what do
you think that thing was? Well my first book pretty much describes what I
thought it was in 1998, which was a power plant. The book is entitled
The Giza Power Plant. My second book has evolved and I describe it as an electron harvester.
So you know, it's kind of like, you could describe it as both, but today, when you do, or people in any decade, they
think of a power plant and they see these huge chimneys with smoke stacks.
Or a new plant.
Yeah, or a new plant, or a power plant dirty, nasty, unclean.
But an electron harvester, clean, pollution free, not a problem.
Has that been achieved conventionally?
I mean today?
Is there a thing called an electron harvester?
I think that actually when you look at a generator, that's an electron harvester, because we don't create electrons, we just harvest them.
It's just how we do it.
And so, you know, when you say an electron harvester,
you could say that, you know, say a wind generator,
you have a windmill, you have a generator inside it it and then you're collecting electrons off the commutator in a generator
And that's where the electricity comes from that's where that's your electricity or hydroelectric you'd use the flow of the water
Yeah, you don't you don't create the like you just
Release them you harvest it from a process
through a process and the process that through a process. And the process that
you think they use in the Great Pyramid involved those shafts? It involves a lot
of things, yeah. It's not just one single thing, it's a system. Not a single
thing. So when you look at... Can we show a photo of that? Do we have a photo of the
pyramids and the shafts and where the king's chamber is, where you, I know you've described this before.
Do you have a photo of?
I do, it's in the...
I was trying to figure out which one you wanted.
Okay, this is perfect, this works.
Yeah, that works.
So these names, the king's chamber and the queen's chamber,
you don't think that that's actually a king's chamber
or a queen's chamber, you think it's something else well out of respect to
the Egyptians I
Call it what they call them. Yeah, but I do have a different
terminology for them as they function
Now the initial surface of the Great Pyramid is covered in smooth limestone, right?
so it's polished and shiny,
and apparently it would collect insane amounts of light.
The, well, the outer surface of the Great Pyramid
mostly is missing, but it has been described as,
if it was finished, and depending on the polish
that it received, yeah, it could.
It could reflect a lot of light.
Do you think that that had something to do with the design of this power plant?
I don't think there's any part of that pyramid that did not have, did not serve a practical
function.
Okay. did not serve a practical function. Okay, so this is the image that you have here
and what this image shows us is the King's Chamber,
the various shafts, the southern shaft,
the northern shaft, and these shafts have been described
as portals to stars because people have looked up
through there and you go through the shaft,
you see stars, but what you're saying
is something entirely different.
What do you think these shafts were for?
Well, I think they serve two different purposes.
Actually, four different purposes, if you will.
Because in the theory that I propose, which is, I don't know, it's a speculation, a theory, it's more,
the whole process is kind of like a heuristic process
where you're grabbing information, you're moving,
doesn't matter what source you're getting it from.
Because when you are looking for answers,
you look everywhere, you try you know, you look everywhere you try and find you know, you look everywhere so
When I was going through the the process of root like trying to figure it out. I was collecting information from every
the
And one of you know for the south for the southern shaft and the northern shaft of the Queen's Chamber
that was a huge mystery to me and I tried to to fit it into the order. What were they doing? I
mean if you look at the details, the facts of their design and what the
ancient Egyptians were doing, why they designed them that way. You have two conduits coming into a chamber, but they're not connected to the chamber. And we didn't
even know they existed until 1872 for Wayman Dixon.
Can you show me that image again, please? So they're coming into the chamber, but they
don't enter into the chamber so they stop.
Their original design had the shafts ending five inches before coming into the chamber.
So you had like five inches of limestone that was left in the block.
So did someone remove that limestone? Yes. Why did they do that? Wayman Dixon,
because they were examining the chamber and they were poking around and Wayman
Dixon, it is reported, so the legend goes, noticed a crack in the wall.
And so he took a rod and pushed it through the crack.
And the rod, it didn't meet any resistance, it kept going.
So he had his worker, a worker come in,
Bill Grundy with a hammer and chisel,
and say chisel the limestone around that.
People are stupid
So well, they did yeah, they didn't have ultrasonic thickness No, but still goddamn to have the arrogance to go and chip away at the pyramid because you're serious look at Howard
you know, I I
Don't care for revisionist
Historians because you know you have to consider
What people were doing, their mindset in the day.
And then I try to look on the bright side, right?
I don't look at it as a negative thing because if somebody hadn't opened up those shafts,
we wouldn't know about them.
And it's the same with the chambers above the King's chamber.
Without Howard Weiss and his military expedition blasting his way up into the pyramid, we wouldn't
know about them either.
You won't be able to, I mean, there's a lot there, I think there's a lot there right now,
and it's been investigated now, but there's things that have been revealed through scanning like Mu off a group muography
The more the scam pyramid project and they found that large void
Above the grand gallery right and so you know, this is larger than the King's Chamber, right?
It's longer than the King's Chamber, yeah.
And so that's not even represented here on this?
It's about the size of the cabin on a Boeing 707.
Wow. So if these shafts came through and then they met limestone at the end,
what do you think was going on?
In order to answer that question, I had to look at the rest of the pyramid, okay, what was it doing and how was it functioning.
And so one of the key pieces of evidence that I used to propose a process that was going on is the northern shaft.
And the northern shaft has dimensions and has an appearance that is similar to a waveguide
that you would use for microwaves. And the dimensions of it would be approximate
wavelength of hydrogen.
Explain a waveguide, how does that work?
Yeah, it's like a waveguide is to transmit microwaves, electromagnetic energy, you know, in the microwave region.
And it is passed more efficiently through like a tube or waveguide.
That's what they use.
I mean, they're very complicated systems, you know.
And so how did this represent in your mind what a wave guide looks like?
Actually, you know, the idea of a wave guide came to me from a guy.
We were talking about the pyramids and I used to I used to carry a schematic of the great pyramid
in my back pocket and I meet an engineer and I go, hey, hey, come here.
I start going through, so what do you think about this?
Because I was looking for answers, suggestions, brainstorming, anything, right?
So these shafts right here and he looks at so these these are these shafts right here
and he looks at it and he was into electronics electronic engineering and
he's like hmm they look like waveguides to me and I thought well that's
interesting they look like waveguides okay what if they are waveguides how do
they function I mean what what would they be right what were they are waveguides? How do they function? I mean, what would they be used for? What were they using waveguides for in ancient Egypt?
And so I started to go down that rabbit hole.
And that led me to the Queen's chamber.
I said, okay, waveguides, you need a medium,
you need microwave to go through a waveguide.
What frequency of microwave was it, right?
And you look at the dimensions
and you come up with a match for hydrogen.
How do you do that?
How do you come up with a match for hydrogen
through the dimensions?
Yeah, yeah, the wavelength of hydrogen is 8.309 inches
The wavelength of hydrogen is 8.309 inches. And the width of the northern shaft is 8.4 inches.
And a waveguide generally has the wavelength and then about half of the wavelength in height.
So it's a rectangular shaft.
Just like all the shafts are.
And the, well, yeah, the Queen's Chamber shaft is a little more square than the King's Chamber
shaft.
So they're a different function.
Different function, yeah.
So these wave guides, you believe, what are connect collecting and where are they getting it from?
Good question Joe
They they had
We are bombarded with
With microwaves every every day. I mean, it's the the signal from they say the Big Bang and you
know there's a it comes from atomic hydrogen out in the universe in outer
space. So we're being bombarded and you believe these passages were collecting
this. Yeah so anyway so then you say okay if we build a device and we say and we want to
Energize hydrogen we bring it to a higher energy state and just like you know in a laser
Where you have
Microwave amplification through stimulated emission right so
So if we want to collect energy that is in a gaseous medium,
say that is hydrogen medium, and the electrons in the hydrogen are pumped up to a higher
energy state and we want to collect the energy in that, introduce a microwave signal, direct
it through that gas and stimulate the emission of the energy,
collect that energy and shoot it up the southern shaft. And so that was like, okay, that might
work.
So what kind of gas?
Hydrogen.
And so where are you getting the hydrogen from?
Queen's chamber.
So there's hydrogen in the Queen's chamber and how does it get in there? The shafts
but they doesn't come in as hydrogen that's that's a part of the
The theory in the Giza power plant was it you know it there are two chemicals
that are introduced into the chamber and
The chemicals mix and they boil off hydrogen and these chemicals are just coming from the radioactive
Waves of space no no no the chemicals I believe are
Manufactured and delivered to those chefs and coming okay, so they add some sort of chemicals to it
And what function does the limestone have at
the end that keeps it from going into the King's chamber? It keeps it blocked off?
Well to answer that question I was having a chat with a civil engineer who
was putting in a septic system for me and and so with a leach field. And he was doing a percolation test, right?
This is in Indiana,
and Indiana is known for its fine limestone.
His name was Roland Dove, a city engineer,
and I asked him, I said, well,
what do you do, how does this function
if you are in an area where there's not much
topsoil, you know, you scrape away maybe a foot of topsoil and then you're on the bedrock.
What do you do then? And he said, well, if you are, limestone is permeable and basically you follow the same steps that you would as
if you were digging into earth, you know, just dirt.
You dig a hole, you cut a hole in the limestone and you determine how quickly the water would
disperse or would actually seep seep out and
I was like wow, okay
So the limestone acts as a filter
Not a foot. Well, I mean it would have filter. Yes, but
definitely the
The water would not just stay there. Right, it would go through it.
It would go through it.
But it would go through it at a certain rate.
And I said, okay, I said, let me ask you this.
How do you determine the flow rate?
How would you determine the flow rate
of a column of water, right, going through limestone.
And he said, well, that would depend on the head pressure.
How much pressure, what weight is pushing
against the limestone, right?
And I go, aha, okay, that's interesting.
So then I go back to the drawing boards, I go back
to my blueprints of the Great Pyramid, and I'm looking at the southern northern shaft
of the Queen's Chamber, and I see that both of these shafts go up to an area that nobody knows where it goes. At that time when I was doing
research, nobody knew where they ended. So, but I was thinking, well, if they are feeding
a call, you know, a chemical, they would need to be assured that they can maintain a particular
head pressure.
That would be calculated, the weight of the column of fluid.
And essentially, as these are on an angle, you know, your calculations may get a little
more complicated, but you would figure it out or you could do it by trial and error. But not all the evidence was in to really kind of
solidify that theory, right? It's like okay I've got this much data this is
what I'm working with. There's a lot of unknowns.
I don't know.
So what do we do?
And then in 1993, a German engineer, Rudolf Gantembrink, he was invited to Egypt and he was working under the German mission in Cairo.
He had permission to, or they wanted him to actually examine, get a robot, examine all
those shafts, both the King's chamber and the Queen's chamber.
Actually, no, mostly the King's chamber and the Queen's chamber. Actually, no, mostly the King's chamber.
They wanted to ventilate the pyramid, and so they wanted to make sure that the shafts
were clear and that when they installed their fans, that there won't be any obstruction.
And so he built a robot to go through these, clean the shafts out,
and then install fans in the Queen's Chamber. But it had always been a mystery in the, as
far as the Queen's Chamber shafts. Where did they end? Nobody knew. Nobody had explored
them that far. So he proposed that they allow him to build another robot and examine the shafts in the
Queen's chamber, which he did that.
He had a robot that he called it Upuatu, which means the opening of the ways. And so with his robot he had a tether behind it and a camera, lights,
and it crawled its way. It was like a track vehicle. There was a mechanism for the upper
track that caused it to grip the ceiling and it was able to climb up the shaft.
They were looking for where it ended.
They found where it ended after a few kind of obstacles, one being what he called a tank trap which was like a depression in the floor of the shaft about
a drop of about two inches which is another story entirely.
I don't think the full truth of why that is there has been figured out yet or explained
but they're working on it.
And so his robot went and got so far up the shaft
and they discovered that there was a block
at the end of the shaft and through the block
two metal fittings.
Metal, what kind of metal?
We don't, I don't know.
So a person hasn't gone over there and gotten a sample of it, so they don't really know, it's just speculation?
I don't know. There's some kind of metal thing. They assumed that they were copper.
And how far is it from the outside edge of the pyramid?
Uh...
Well, you do ask some awkward questions. I don't have that information in front of me.
But I would say that if you are wanting to reach the end of the, where that southern
shaft is, the shortest route that you could take would be through a horizontal passage
that goes directly out to the outer surface of the Great Pyramid.
Just a horizontal passage.
Okay.
Going up, going down.
Can I see the image again, please?
So what we're looking at, when you're seeing the shafts...
Hold on a second.
No worries.
More helpful with that part or do you want the whole thing?
I want to see what it looks like on the outside.
Yeah, that one.
So say it again, what would be the best way to access it?
Yeah, I mean if you go to the end of the shaft and just have a short horizontal shaft going or passage going out to the going out to the outer face
you would have a shorter distance than if you went up
you know or down so that would be the ideal
place to have access to it
but it doesn't go this makes it look like it goes all the way to the outside
edge of the pyramid
That's not the case. Well the Queen's chamber shop. No the King's chamber shaft
Oh the King's chamber shaft does go to the it goes all the way outside all the way to the outside
Okay, and so the Queen's chamber shaft it stops quite a bit before the outside edge of the pyramid, right?
So both of them function in a different way
Yes edge of the pyramid. So both of them function in a different way. And so you feel like in
the King's Chamber Shaft that something was poured in, some kind of chemicals was poured
into those shafts. Queen's Chamber Shaft. But not the King's Chamber Shaft.
So the Queen's Chamber Shaft, what is the difference and why do you think that there
was chemicals poured in that and not into the King's Chamber? Because the Queen's Chamber was a reaction chamber, so that's where the hydrogen was
produced.
The hydrogen filled the interior spaces of the Great Pyramid and also which included
the King's Chamber.
And then through the action, different actions, whether it be
the Freund effect which we can talk about and that's the release of electrons
from the lithosphere or the accumulation of vibration or the collection of
vibration and how it was centered or focused into the King's
chamber it created a highly energized atmosphere. So have they found access to
the northern and southern shafts in in the Queen's chamber? To the to the shafts
have they found access where the Egyptians would have been able to pour chemicals into
those?
No, not yet.
Not yet.
No.
But they have found something that's not represented on this image, another chamber, right, which
is more recent.
Right.
I mean, my new book has updated images in it to describe what is what new has been discovered.
And that new chamber is above the King's chamber, is that correct?
It's actually above the Grand Gallery.
And it kind of wraps around or is, you know, close to the northern shaft. That's an interesting
place for it to be too, which prompted
my research associate, Eric Wilson, who is an
aerospace engineer, to suggest that that actually
feature, if it is what he thinks it is, would complete my
theory, because it would serve as a Feature if it is what he thinks it is would have complete my theory
because it would serve as a
Preamp for the microwave so the microwave he said that was the thing that was missing in my theory was that I didn't there was No preamp. So is there an image that we can look at that shows where this new chamber the newly discovered
I should say chamber.
Could I take a break?
Yes, sure, sure, sure.
I need to go to...
Yeah, absolutely.
We'll be right back.
All right.
So you were just discussing the chambers and how you believe fluid was in the shafts of
the Queen's chamber and that it somehow or another created hydrogen
with these chemicals. How is the microwave going through those chambers if it's blocked
off from the outside? Is it penetrating through the stone?
Well, it doesn't go into the Queen's Chamber, so it's through the King's chamber shafts which are open.
Okay, so the King's chamber shafts is what's collecting the microwaves. The Queen's chamber
shafts have what you believe some chemicals in there.
Right.
And then what is happening with those chemicals?
They're mixing and boiling off hydrogen.
Okay, so they're creating hydrogen.
Right.
And what is the function of the space in those
shafts? Does that help the chemical process? Is that what it is? The space in the shafts.
Where they're filling them up with liquid? Oh yes, that is predetermined to make sure or that they maintained a head pressure.
The fittings or the metal fittings, I describe as switches, like fluid switches.
So if once when the fluid or the chemical
was covering those metal fittings,
I call them electrodes, there would be a closed circuit. When the fluid level drops, it would open the circuit and signal the need for more chemicals to be pumped in, in order to maintain the head pressure, in order to make sure that there is an accurate
supply of that chemical.
And so that chemical would pool up inside of the Queen's Chamber?
It would probably, yes.
I mean, there's a lot that is missing from the Queen's Chamber.
You have a niche in the east wall.
We don't know what that was for.
I suspect that it had something to do with,
it may have been an evaporation tower or something like that
where the chemicals mixed and waked up through some materials
and, you know, maybe it dried.
Can you show me the image again please?
So here we have, so there's the chemicals that are in the shafts.
You have the Queen's chamber which is collecting the hydrogen.
And then what happens into the King's chamber? Well while that is going on the Queen the King's chamber is
Vibrating in sympathy with the earth
And
It has it becomes it is actually a coupled oscillator with the earth
How so how does that work? Well a coupled oscillator is a device that's attached to a larger
vibrating device
and
is in sympathy. And what is causing the King's chamber to vibrate?
The
passage of
vibration through the pyramid.
Of the Earth? of vibration through the pyramid of the earth of the earth which is assisted it's coupled by using
what I call a Tesla device in the in the subterranean chamber because you've got you've got three four
you got several systems in there right So if you got the subterranean
chamber, that serves one function. You go up to the Queen's chamber, that serves another
function. You go up to the King's chamber, that serves another function. And in between,
you have the grand gallery, the ascending passage, got the descending passage, all of
these things are there for a reason.
And so the subterranean chamber, how do you think that worked?
I would speculate that, and actually if you read Tesla and some of his writings, he suggests that with a very little energy, you could build a device
that imparts energy or thrusts into a structure.
And if it is in harmony or the exact frequency
with that structure, it could bring the structure down
just by an accumulation of energy, of
vibration. The amplitude would keep and if you kept pounding, getting pounding, getting
pounding, eventually it would all come down. That's why they instructed soldiers when they're on the march to break step when they cross a bridge
mmm, because their footsteps might
Cause the bridge to oscillate mmm and this and destroy is a very destructive forces is that this
This you know frequencies are
oscillating by the vibrations so what would
caught what kind of device in the subterranean chamber would do that he
built a device that delivers thrusts and powers it was electromagnetic
earthquake machine it's called right mm-hmm you could do it electro
mechanical you could have electro-hydraulic,
you know, just anything, but you have to be able to time the action. And so,
okay, you think of it like you've got a device, you've got a cylinder, you've got a
shaft coming out of it, and you've got a hammer, or you've got a shaft coming out of it and you got a hammer or you got a copper pan or whatever
at the end of it and you design it so that that shaft is going to push out at a particular
frequency.
So you got a piston.
Boom, boom, boom, boom.
And so you put it against a structure that structure has a natural frequency
Right all structures do
You might hit one with a fist and don't think it had you know, it would resonate at all
But if you go
the first
the first trike
May impart enough energy to move something maybe a couple of angstroms,
right?
And so it's like very, very minute movement.
The next one will move it a little more.
Then you just keep pounding it.
Just keep pounding it.
And as you pound it, the oscillations become bigger the amplitude becomes bigger and if you keep
doing it you can bring it bring the the whole thing down so the key is to do it
at a rate that is able to utilize the hydrogen well you know at this point
hydrogen has nothing to do with it I mean this is this is just a totally
separate subsystem it doesn't care if there's hydrogen in the pyramid. But this
is this subsystem exists to vibrate the King's pyramid. Just to connect the
pyramid with the earth. Right okay so it's it's vibrating the pyramid. the hydrogen in the Queen's chamber now, it makes its way into the King's
chamber?
Well, yes.
I mean, it flows up through the ground, along the horizontal passage through the Grand Gallery
and up into the King's chamber.
So all this is connected.
Oh, that's connected.
So the hydrogen goes up, it goes in the King's chamber, So all this is connected. All that's connected. So the hydrogen goes up, it goes in the King's chamber,
which is a phenomenal structure.
Right.
Carved out of granite from 500 miles away, massive stones,
the biggest stones in the pyramid, correct?
Right.
And so what happens with the vibration of the pyramid
through this thing that's connected to the earth and subterranean chamber
Constantly hitting boom boom boom vibrating the hydrogen flows into the great chamber the great the the the King's chamber rather King's chambers
Vibrating and then you have these shafts that come from the outside of the King's chamber into it. So what's happening there?
Okay
Well, let's let's go back to the subterranean.
Alright, okay. And let's talk about not what happens in the pyramid, but what is happening
in the earth. Okay. And this is where we introduce Tesla technology and also the work of a NASA physicist called Friedman Freund.
So Friedman Freund has done research on earthquake lines and his objective was to try to determine if we could detect or if we could have an early
warning system for earthquakes and he was using NASA satellites to survey the
earth and to observe for where when earthquake lights show up and his his theory it's not really a theory it's a scientific
fact is that in the in the minerals in igneous rock that you have these
positive charge carriers that when they are stressed they will shoot to the surface.
And the positive charge carriers are like, they call them holes.
He describes it as a new physics but it's kind of related to semiconductor physics which
is a little above my head.
But still, he's talking about releasing electrons from deep within the earth and those electrons when they're stimulated
To move they move very very quickly
Through the pyramid. I mean through the earth and and they seek the highest point
On the surface of the earth, so you have Tesla on one side and he's saying that if you could put a like an
earthquake machine and just drive you know frequency into the planet you might be able
to release the stresses in the earth's crust and also reduce the possibility of an earthquake. I'm not saying eliminated
entirely but at least you would release some pressure. Yeah you would release some
pressure. And so you know with with that it's it becomes you put in these little
bits of disparate information together and you combine
them and you say, oh, maybe there is something here. I think, you know, the biggest discovery,
which is not talked about very much, is Friedemann-Freund's discovery of the physics behind earthquake lights and he actually experimented
in his lab.
He has a YouTube video with him, he explains it a lot better.
Do you want to pull that up and watch it?
Well, we could but the problem is we'll get flagged. Oh, okay then. He uses YouTube video.
Okay, all right. So for those, you know, listening
you can search freedom and Freund and
just Freund, F-R-E-N-E-e-f-r-e-u-n-d and Tedx talk in Christ Church New Zealand.
It's an excellent video. He explains it.
So something is happening in this subterranean chamber.
Yep.
And this something is causing the pyramid and the earth around
it to vibrate. Mm-hmm. And how is that affecting the hydrogen and how is that
affecting what's what's happening in the King's chamber? Okay, so you have a
combination of you've got two different kinds of energy now flowing through the
Great Pyramid. You've got electromagnetic energy and you've also got mechanical energy.
Right.
Okay, so you've got the mechanical energy of this thing that's striking.
You have the passages that are filled with chemicals that's causing the accumulation
of hydrogen.
The hydrogen is making its way into the King's Chamber.
And then what is the function of these passageways that go into the King's chamber from the outside?
Well the northern shaft carries a microwave signal that signal passes
through a amplifier and then the signal enters into the chamber and collects the energy that has been accumulating in that
space.
It's like a laser or a maze.
So the chambers are collecting microwave energy from space.
It's going through them and it's going, excuse me, the passageways rather, it's going through them and it's going excuse the passageways rather it's going into the chamber
Which is vibrating and it's filled with hydrogen
So what what is this reaction that happens when these two things meet?
Okay, the action of that is the same as a laser where you where you have
the introduction of
a where you have the introduction of a photon in a laser, right?
That photon passes through an energized medium where the electrons are pumped to a higher
energy state, then the
that photon collects another photon and then another one and it just builds and builds and builds and builds.
But it does it at the speed of light, obviously. And so that's why when you say you have a laser pointer, that process is what
happens before the light appears on your slide or
whatever. You press the button and it's kind of instant, right? But there's been a lot
going on since when you press that button to create that laser light.
I see. But it just happens at the speed of light.
It just happens so fast. Right. So this King's chamber, when it has the hydrogen in it, you have the electrons, you have the
vibration of the thing, you have the microwaves coming in.
What do you think this is?
You have microwaves coming in, but then you have power output.
Power output.
Yeah.
So the power output is the the southern shaft and
This is where you there's another piece of key evidence
Jamie could you show the slide that shows the opening of the southern shaft, please?
It's crazy that this makes sense. Well, I was trying to get there's a bunch of slides in here that are really interesting, but we haven't got to them yet.
Well, we got time. We'll get to those.
What it said, you know, I don't know about me.
You're doing great. I may pass out.
Have another cup of coffee. Here's the northern shaft.
That's the northern shaft. OK.
Wait a minute. go to the newest slides
i think there are better images on those
yeah these were uh created back in the day
okay hold on go nothing said southern see okay here okay just stop here okay
okay all right so uh my first book I didn't have a really accurate
description of the northern shift okay and and so since then we got the the
cadroids of Rudolph Gantembrink when he did an examination and he did a great
great job measuring everything every angle
distance all the way to the outside and so this is taken from his CAD drawing and I just kind of
you know made it a little more striking clear or people could understand the complexity of that shaft.
And also to point out some of the details that are pretty mind-blowing.
You have four bends, one, two, three, four, before it goes into the King's chamber. Okay, now where is that
opening? It is at the quarter wave location and in a resonant cavity, the
highest amplitude could be found at a quarter wave. So it's like if you've got a standing wave
in a resonant cavity, it's the quarter wave that's with the quarter of the distance along the length
of the cavity. That's where your amplitude, that's where your energy is the highest.
So at least in this placement it affirms your theory. That's where it would be.
Right. But the other thing is, and this is this information of course is common, I mean
I've talked to people who worked on waveguides. Eric Wilson is very familiar
with them and he did a study of Gantembrink's drawings and he said yeah
this, this, this and he's pointing out different unusual features in the shaft that seem to appear in the design of
modern waveguides because you have changes in dimension you have these
steps there is a like a bump in an area and it's all to kind of massage manipulate the beam as
it comes into the pyramid but then when it when it comes to entering into the
great the the King's chamber they go through four bends he said that that's
that's to be able to correct the beam so that when it does
enter the pyramid it is coherent and it goes in straight. Wow. So it's literally
how you would design it? The other thing is that the, and this is mind blowing, and it will tell you a lot.
There is another drawing of a planned view of that shaft, Jamie.
Hold on, I think, wait a minute.
Yeah, no, below the one with the, below that one, directly.
Yeah, nope, you passed it.
Yeah, that one.
Okay, so you know the commonly held theory about why those shafts exist is to ventilate the Great Pyramid, right?
Mm-hmm.
Okay.
And that the reason why they have those bends is for it to encircle the Grand Gallery so
that it doesn't interfere with the Grand Gallery.
Now, if you're just going to ventilate that place, you would need that many bends.
But look at the distance between the Grand Gallery wall and the North Shaft.
It is 13.6 feet, right? If you take
where the the level where the shaft enters the King's Chamber and you take
it straight past the Grand Gallery, you're looking at dimension E, which is 41 inches.
So it would clear the Grand Gallery.
It didn't have to go through all those bends unless the wall blocks of the Grand Gallery were so large that they didn't want to interfere
with them.
And so does that suggest that the wall block thickness, because we don't know how thick
they are, we don't know how thick they are, but that suggests that they are maybe just a little less than 13 feet thick.
That is mind-blowing.
How heavy are those things?
Yeah.
So, the way it's set up here, especially when you're looking at it from this It really does kind of make sense that this is a passageway
for gases and energy
And the way I'm looking I mean it looks like if you're looking at like this looks like like a system. It's a machine
You were you were pointing about you were talking about the southern shaft
Right and that the southern shaft there's an outside image.
Yeah, could you show that one?
Which image is it?
Oh, it's coming, I think.
Well, I think you're going the wrong way, Jamie.
There wasn't another picture the other way.
I can Google it if you want me to find it, but I don't know if it was here.
It's in there.
Got down to the bottom of the shaft. There wasn't another picture the other way. I can Google it if you want me to find it, but I don't know if it was here.
It's in there. Go down.
How many images are in here?
Hundreds. How many did you want?
Oh, hold on. Oh, wait a minute. No, just just above right. It was right below the previous
picture that we were talking about. Number 47. That's no just below that. Yeah, there.
Okay. Okay. So the bottom left photograph is the opening of the southern shaft I mean yeah the southern
shaft of the Kings chamber okay I took a photograph of it in 1986 okay the one on
the right I took in 1995 and that was after Rudolf Gantembrink had installed
the fan but if you look at that opening you see that you have like
a bulbous opening almost looks like a microwave or an antenna. Right? So it's
not it's not just a straight simple shaft it's like it's like a catcher's
mitt. Okay yeah. Right? I mean it, it's just all of these different features of this
chamber, but most, I mean, you would overlook them, right? But you would design
it that way if you were trying to catch microwaves. Yeah. And so the southern
shaft and the northern shaft have different functions.
And you believe that the northern shaft is collecting the microwave energy?
It is channeling the microwave.
Channeling the microwave energy.
Yeah, I mean they would have some system on the outside to collect them.
You know, I mean they may have a very large area actually collecting microwaves and feeding
it to a reflector that is directed down the northern shaft.
I mean, you know that there are eight sides to the pyramid, right?
Each side, it dips in. So it doesn't go straight across, it dips in.
I don't know where that reflector would have been positioned, but
they could have been reflecting microwaves off the surface of the Great Pyramid to a
reflector at a distance away and that reflector channeled it down the northern shaft.
That would be one way to do it?
That would be one way to do it, yeah.
So either way, you believe that the northern shaft was somehow or
Another collecting microwave energy and the southern shaft
Do you
What would they do with that energy? This is the question like well, that's yeah, that's the your signal input
That that's what enters the King's chamber and stimulates emission of other
Photons right but one is it once this energy is correct connected right once it's once they have it collected
How are they dispersed? How are they using it? How are they utilizing it?
Your good your guess is as good as mine I
Can own I mean I can only imagine if they can dream up how to build
this system, how they machined those precision vases, how they built the boxes and the serapim,
how they created the statues, and knowing that there's so much missing from that culture.
Not only that, but knowing that you have to have something
that you can use to make this in the first place.
Yes.
Like what kind of material are you using
to carry these things?
There's so much missing.
You know, it's kind of like
all right so you're saying that you use the pyramid to create energy and with
that energy you powered your power tools to build the Great Pyramid. That
doesn't make any sense. Doesn't make any sense at all. So there was probably some
other methods that we're not aware of.
Yeah, yeah.
Obviously.
I mean, you build any power plant, you're going to have generators on site.
They're going to wheel them in and power them up.
Also, this is not going to be your first project.
You already have some understanding of how this stuff works if you're making something
at this scale. Well, I mean our
industrial development, what, 200 years of development?
Imagine if it's 500 years of development or a thousand years from now.
Yeah.
Right?
Jamie, go back to that image where it showed the cross-section that he said, we'll stop at this one. No, there was one earlier,
but that's fine.
Either one of them.
There was another one that showed sort of a cross section.
That's it, that's it, thank you.
So this gives us an understanding
of what it would look like originally.
There was a gold cap on the top,
smooth limestone on the sides.
What do you think the function of that gold cap was?
Because gold is used in electricity, in electronic components, it's a great conductor of electricity.
Well, this is where you combine the Tesla's technology and also Freund's laboratory experiments. And in the laboratory, what Freund did is he got a granite slab, a couple of feet long,
and he put it in a hydraulic press in order to test his theory that if, you know, Ignis Rock is put under pressure, it releases
electrons.
So he wanted to test that.
And he set the granite up in his concrete press.
I mean, concrete press.
Hydraulic press. And then he ran a wire through an oscilloscope and then attached it to a copper cap on the
other end of the granite. So there has to be some kind of a connection. All right, so you got electrons moving, you know, you got positive
charge carriers shooting through the granite and then they're handshaking at the end with
the negative electrons and everybody does a happy dance and fires up their their microwaves.
Just kidding. But that that is. And then you combine that with Tesla and his proposal to build a system where you can transmit
electricity wirelessly without wires through the earth and he built the Waldencliff Tower, which was like a structure that would radiate that power.
So that's the inspiration for this image right here.
So the idea would be that this whole thing
would be emitting wireless electricity.
Yes.
And so that they would be able to utilize that somehow,
like Tesla had theorized.
Tesla.
We actually implemented it, right, in tests, right?
Yeah.
I mean, Tesla Power, Tesla Cars, too, probably.
So have you debated anyone about this as any
Egyptologist or any person who doesn't agree with your theory sat down with you and and tried to pick it apart. I
Am NOT a fan of debates
Myself I mean, I know it's good theater and some people are really good at it. Mm-hmm and
And you were able to
demonstrate that the other week. But I'm not a big fan of them. I'm not sure as
far as scientists go, science or you know putting work out there for examination by your peers, and I'm not sure that it is
how helpful to you know, you know set up a
Shouting match or a
But I'm just interested to see what other people have to think about your theory because this this is really fascinating to me. I'm looking at all this and I'm like, wow, this makes so much more sense than having
this thing there as just a tomb for a dead guy, which there's not a lot of evidence that
that's the case because they've never actually found.
No, no. I mean, you know, if you asked me, what was it? Well, Chris, what the hell were you thinking?
When we were thinking, you know, I mean, and that is actually a key question
because, you know, if you're a you're an examiner or if you are pleading, pleading
you something or somebody is challenging you.
something or somebody is challenging you.
What your state of mind was when something happened and an event happened, what was your state of mind
at the time is important.
And my state of mind at the time was the tomb theory
is a dead theory, I don't accept it.
The pyramid, because of its design, its features, its precision, it looked like a machine, perhaps
it's a machine.
And if it is a machine, how did the machine operate?
So that's basically what my state of mind was. And the evidence that I was looking at was evidence of a level of sophistication and
a structure that actually demonstrated the highest level of state of the art that that
civilization or that that culture produced
Or any culture any culture and and it hasn't been replicated since
How is that possible?
How is it the whole thing is so impossible like if you wanted to have the the best evidence that we don't know shit
It's got you got it right there. It's like what are we how much do we know about what they knew if they could make that? Yeah, people ask me, why haven't you built a model?
And I was like, you don't understand.
Because I couldn't even afford one of the blocks that goes into the king's chamber,
let alone a thousand of them.
And also, like, how much time would it take you to build that? Good Lord.
Not only that, it's like, you know, if you're going to replicate, I was asked that question
when I was in Egypt in 2021. And I was with Hamada Amar and Dr. Haini Halal, who used to be the Minister of Science and Higher
Education, both extremely, extremely good guys, and they are both on the SCAM pyramid
mission team.
So I had a meeting with them. And I gave my book to Dr. Halal, and Hamada already had one, he'd arranged
a meeting. I gave my book to Haley Halal and I described it briefly and he says, well, could the Great Pyramid be restored and function
as you envision that it did? And I was like, I'd pondered that question before and I thought, I can't see that happening. You know, I mean, if you were going to, if you're going to replicate it or create another
one, I would do another one, you know, because of the political climate.
Right, of course.
There is so much focus on the Great Pyramid and everybody who's focused on it is an expert
and most of them have YouTube channels.
So you have a whole hyper focus on that area.
I mean just the simple thing like, okay, we're going to recover the Third Pyramid.
We're going to restore it. We're gonna recover it, and blah blah blah.
People start freaking out.
Yeah, I mean, it was a whole shit storm that came after that.
I mean, they finally killed the project because...
I saw.
Do you think that it's good they killed the project?
I mean, isn't it good to leave that stuff in the state in which we found it? I think, you know, people with the best of intentions
and working with the information that they have
can make mistakes.
And a lot of times, and I've made them myself,
a lot of times it's because I'm making decisions not having
sufficient information, right? So it's kind of like they were, he was the new chief of
the Supreme Council of Antiquities, the chairman of the Supreme Council of Antiquities.
And so he had a gentleman who was going to help him restore the Third Pyramid.
And so he goes out and calls a press conference and tells everybody what they're going to
do. And then there was a firestorm of criticism that came in, just flooded in.
And then finally, I think it was Zai Hawass who pulled his influence to shut the project
down. And then so they backed up on it. But
you know if he had touched all the bases, I mean you just never know because relationships
in any culture you don't understand them. You know you don't know who knows who, who's
related to who. You know you you don't know who knows who, who's related to who. You know,
you got all this activity.
But I think people rightly so were upset at the idea of covering that thing just like
they covered up the paws of the sphinx. It's very controversial, right?
Not necessarily covering it, but restoring it.
But you are covering it, right?'re doing well you are in human your
trance yeah yeah yeah you're you're ruining what is left what in the state that it is
it represents the erosion and the earthquakes the looting of the limestone this is what
it is so this is cover it up with twenty twenty four work seems gross
right and that's what a lot of people think is that it is not
respecting history or you know
so if they did that with the great pyramid and covered the whole thing
well i mean yeah i mean that
that would certainly be more possible
than building another one
uh... right well you certainly uh... it's a lot easier you won't have to quarry be more possible than building another one. Yeah. Right? Well you would certainly,
it's a lot easier. You wouldn't have to quarry as much limestone. Not even close.
So if they did that, let's just imagine a world where people say, hey we're gonna
do this but we could always reverse it. We're not gonna do any permanent damage
to the pyramid but it's possible to restore it to the exact state
and find out if this theory is correct.
Yeah, but how do you do that? I mean, I don't think you would have to have a lot more research
and evidence produced than I have produced to convince people to invest so much money.
Because I mean this is a process, okay?
The Giza power plant and Giza-Tesla connection, it's a process, right?
I'm pretty much at the end of that process.
So I put it out in the universe and then other people are picking it up like Ahmadadli, you know,
Ashraf Skabini at Cairo University.
But let's imagine we enter into a world where people say, you know what, it's better if
we know and there's only one way to know and it's possible to do.
So let's cover that thing the way it was done before.
Let's put a gold cap on it.
Let's follow the plans as if this is a power plant.
Right. But first you have to qualify, verify all the subsystems and their functions. And
it's complicated.
And would you qualify that,
could it be more possible today through use of AI?
You would need, well,
whoever is in control of the AI who's driving.
Right, but let's look at best case scenario.
Let's pretend there's some objective scientists
that are not ideologically driven at all,
and they're in control of this AI,
and they utilize it the exact way we would like it to be utilized. What I would love is for some PhD student to
take on as a dissertation project the acoustic modeling of the interior of the
Great Pyramid.
Get all the dimensions, scan everything, find out all the dimensions, what they are,
and then you start to simulate the behavior of the movement of sound within that space. We have, you know, we're using human instruments to detect resonance and report on the vibrations
and how they feel when they hear it.
You know, there's a lot of like magical experiences that are happening. But the magic, I mean, if you've ever read Arthur C. Clarke
is kind of like sufficiently advanced technology
is first seen as magic, right?
So if you have an alien race
and they have sufficiently advanced technology, you would look at it as magic.
Right.
Our cell phones.
Sure.
If they appeared in our culture a hundred years ago.
Magic.
Magic.
Yeah.
Yeah.
People wouldn't know what to do with them.
And if this culture had something that's not where we are but 500 years more advanced
than us, which is why they were able to create something like that.
Right, I mean.
It looks like magic.
I talk about the recent disclosure by the ODI
on the UAPs in here.
Really?
Yeah.
You think they're connected?
As an example, as an example of what is possible,
physically, because if you consider that you know
those UAPs can descend from 80,000 feet to sea level in a few seconds that the
G-forces that they would pull on a 90 degree turn will be like a thousand G's
that would destroy any of our craft and
the people inside it, if it was even possible to make such a turn, which it's not. We don't
have anything to match it. And then you see how they function, you see what can we observe
on how they are propelled. You know, an F-16, they've got afterburners and we see these afterburners kick on and
fire belching out the back.
Those UAPs, they just seem to have some kind of aura around them and they defeat gravity
and move through space in a way that appears like magic.
But sufficiently advanced technology would be magical right almost less impressive than a cell phone
Right cuz all it's doing is flying around my cell phone is sending instantaneous video to the other side of the world
Well that little UAP could be doing the same. Yeah, sure except to other planets, right?
We just don't see all the mothership which is
Or we don't see it. It might behip, which is... Or Langley....clonked and we don't see it.
It might be American.
It's all science fiction, right?
I really wonder how much of that stuff is ours.
How much of that stuff is Black Ops projects?
I don't think we have it.
Like some stuff that they've been...
You don't think so?
No.
You think it's from somewhere else?
I mean, I can't prove where it's from, but if it is from somewhere else, I'd like to
follow it home.
You and me both.
I'd like to see the, I'd like to observe the civilization and the culture that created
it.
Go in the manufacturing plant, say, how are you making this?
And say, okay, where where you getting your power from? I don't see any, you know, train cars carrying tons of coal
and belching chimneys out in the distance, right?
Well, if there's a time machine,
if there was ever a time machine,
I've always said, if I could go back to one place,
it would be, I'd go back to Africa
when they were doing that.
I'd go to Egypt.
Oh, for sure.
I'd see what they, what were you doing?
For sure.
What were you doing? What were you doing?
How were you guys doing this?
What the hell is going on over here?
And where did it all go?
I mean, I know the burning of the Library of Alexandria,
they lost so much.
We have no idea what was in there
and what knowledge they had preserved.
So now it's all lost.
And if you're correct, if they really did have some sort
of a
Machine that makes electricity that to this day when we're I mean you want renewable electricity there you go kids, right?
It's right there and somehow or another someone did it four thousand five hundred years ago, right? How?
What did you what did you guys do and how are you so much more advanced than all the other humans on earth?
I'm so much more advanced than all the other humans on earth? I'm so much more I'm digging through an article right now of some audio engineers that got access to the Great Pyramid
Like they took in a bunch of high-powered speakers and whatnot very first thing this guy recognized here. He says
He noticed that there's a very specific precise frequency when the wind blows across some of the air shafts and so f-sharp.
Yeah and that appears in the I think Tom Danly who was a NASA engineer and he was
on the team and did acoustic testing inside the Great Pyramid. He measured the frequencies in the King's
Chamber and reported that even with all his equipment turned off, the King's Chamber
was still vibrating. And he actually...
Go back, Jamie.
Oh, sure.
Look at this right here. It says, ancient Egyptian texts indicate that this F sharp
was the resonant harmonic center of planet Earth. Yes, yeah that's the connection that's the seismic connection.
The F sharp is also coincidentally it says in question marks the tuning
reference for the sacred flutes of many North American shamans. Yeah the hope is
yeah so the F sharp is very important. It's also
found in human DNA believe it. Yeah and there was a Dr. David Deemer who actually
mapped the frequencies of DNA. As an engineer I will note 16 Hertz is just
below the human threshold of hearing. the best you can hear is 20 interesting
So no dogs hear that Carl here that they're known for hearing higher. I suppose they could probably hear lower
What is this dad?
but
In the around 2003 I was contacted by a very talented
Physicist his name is dust Kerr. You can Google Dustin
Kerr if you like. He got his PhD at Cornell University and his thesis, dissertation was was actually creating a nano guitar. Whoa.
Yeah.
The nano guitar, the strings are just about a hundred atoms wide.
Whoa.
And you have to have an electron microscope, tunneling an electron microscope to be able
to see it.
And so anyway, he contacted me and I was really impressed
with this guy. How would you strum that guitar? With a laser light. Whoa, it's two microns?
Oh my god, that that scale is two micron? Yeah. Wow, that's bananas. So he used a laser to play this guitar,
you would need Yeah, I mean, just a very, very subtle laser, which, you know, is
like micro heat, expand, expand the strings, and you would you would get
they would vibrate. But you can hear it, of course. Right, of course, go away.
Right. But but it exists.
So the frequency that's in the great chamber is below the threshold for humans to hear.
Yeah, it's...
Currently.
...ephra-sonic.
Right, but if this machine was running it would probably be a different frequency, right?
All those frequencies would be playing a part, plus plus more I would say the you know and
besides his nano guitar when we were communicating Dr. Carr did a model
model the finite element analysis of the Great Pyramid and Guess what what 16 Hertz showed up in that?
Wow
fascinating so
The whole thing is just so crazy
That it blows your mind it really does is there's so many questions in so many places to take it to is
Yeah, the real question is like
How did they do it where did they
learn all this stuff from and did they implement this somewhere else is this
the only power plant they ever created the other pyramids do they have similar
function I think the fundamentally perhaps they you perhaps the science of tapping into or harvesting electrons through stimulating
movement in the lithosphere was probably known and that knowledge was advanced and developed.
Right. But if you have what this design,
what you believe the Great Pyramid,
how it was used as a power plant,
what do you think is going on
with the other two pyramids that are near it?
Same thing, except they have different interior designs.
They're all part of the system.
So, oh, so it's all connected.
All three of them are connected somehow.
Yeah.
And have you observed similar situations in those smaller pyramids where it seems like
they would be utilized in a similar fashion?
Is there shafts and chambers?
No, I just think if you are considering it as a project. Okay, so you design a project, you propose a
project, you gather the resources to complete the project, you describe it to
your investors. I mean ultimately it's about
Follow the money. How much is it gonna cost and what's the return on investment?
And so you have okay. I want to build a great pyramid and we're gonna have all this
You know, we're gonna have all this energy and I'll build another
Few pyramids around it and they'll just be tourist attractions. No.
Right. No. No. I mean if you if you've got the whole plateau and the lithosphere
beneath it I mean Freund said that the lithosphere is actually a giant
battery. It can turn into a giant battery if it is stimulated, right?
Right. And so if you've got that condition, you've got all that potential
energy under your feet, all you've got to do is shake it a little bit, you know, and
just go, hey, send me a few more electrons. And you build a system on the surface.
Perhaps you survey the area, just like, you know, NASA satellites surveyed the
area for freedom of flying. And you build a
pulse generator deep under the Giza plateau and you start that system up and
you survey the area and you look for the hot spots right where the the maximum
number of electrons are coming are coming through from the lithosphere and
then you say okay we'll build a pyramid there build one there we'll build one
there those are your hotspots.
You know, you got a hotspotting in Texas, right?
Oh really?
Yeah, Marfa, Marfa, Texas.
What is it?
It's a town, I think you're smart.
Oh no, I know Marfa, but how is it a hotspot?
Oh, Marfa Lights, have you heard of those?
No.
Yeah, pull up the Marfa Lights.
Is it like ball lightning? No, it's kind of like a light show. Really? Yeah. Pull up the Marfa lights. Is it like ball lightning?
No, it's kind of like a light show.
Really? Yeah.
And what's it for? It's very famous.
And it's from the electrons.
Not famous, in Austin, obviously.
Well, I know Marfa.
I have a friend who has a house in Marfa.
Really? Yeah, he loves it there.
So it's like a kind of an artist community, right?
Probably the energies, right?
Mm hmm. Like Sedona, right? Yeah, right? That's where all the weirdos
go. Yeah, I'm one of those weirdos. I can't afford to live there. Oh, it's a gorgeous
place. Sedona's gorgeous. So what is this? So there's this interview, I think, I'm imagining
what they're trying to say here without listening to everything. So these lights, what's going
on with these lights? What is this? It's a light interview on the marfa light. Oh, okay? Okay?
I don't know exactly so when you see those things flying around the sky. What are they?
Is that like ball lightning? Yeah, I mean it's the electrons coming from the earth and ionizing the air
It says according to
Judith It says, according to Judith Breuesque, the Marfa lights of West Texas have been called
many names over the years such as ghost lights, weird lights, strange lights, car lights,
mystery lights, or Chianti lights.
My favorite place from which to view the lights is a widened shoulder on Highway 90 about
9 miles east of Marfa.
The lights are most often reported at distant spots of brightness distinguishable from branch
lights and automotive headlights on 67 so primarily distinguished by their aberrant
movements so these things just sort of fly around. The first historical record of the
Marfa lights was 1883 when the young cowhand, Robert Reed Ellison, saw a flickering light while
he was driving cattle through the Paisano Pass and wondered if it was a campfire of
the Apache. Other settlers told him they often saw the lights, but when they investigated
they found no ashes or evidence of a campsite. So what is happening again with these lights?
How is it? It's electrons going through the earth? If you if you consider Freund's theory from the Freund effect, it's the release of
positive charge carriers from the lithosphere shooting up to the surface
and ionizing the air. Okay and so it creates a light that way. So it creates a
light that way. a lot of people have
speculated that it could be like a piece of electric activity and
course bearing rock but
Brian doesn't support that idea
I don't think but it would sort of support this theory that if you could find places where that is happening naturally
Yeah, like Marfa, and you established the pyramid there.
You had one other thing that you had just said to me
when we took a break, that there was some evidence
that you knew about this Dibble-Hancock debate
that had come to light.
Oh, yeah, that was interesting.
A fellow researcher, Manu Saifadeh, he wrote the book Under the Sphinx.
He had posted on Facebook a paper that had been published.
I think the discussion was the existence of industrial activity during the Ice Age.
Right.
Okay.
And so, you know, I talked to him and he sent me several papers where other studies have been done and that show
the same kind of
markers that you see in that period of time
in the paper that he
presented on the podcast. So
you know everybody should have a chance to fix their mistakes, right?
But they are, could you pull them up, Jamie?
And we could just go through them.
And then they will be on record.
Okay, so what is wrong?
So what you're saying is that, what he was saying is that the evidence of industrialization
only occurs after a specific time in the core samples.
Right.
There's no evidence of them in the Ice Age.
And is this lead?
What is it in?
Right, right.
I mean, this is out of my wheelhouse.
I'm not an expert witness.
But this gentleman posted this in response to.
I'm just saying that if there is, you know, another body of evidence or other papers that
have been conducted, that my research has been conducted that go further back into the past, in the period of time that Dibble's paper deals with,
then they should be introduced into the record also.
And how far in the past did these go?
150,000 years.
And how far in the past did the ones that Dibble introduced go?
I think it was what, between 1000 BC to 1000 AD or something.
It was just like a...
A narrow window.
A narrow window.
Okay, so did you find it, Jamie?
Well, I don't have Clint's stuff
because that was on his computer.
Well, his paper, the paper that he referenced is in there.
The one that you brought?
Yeah.
Okay, well I have what you brought.
This is what you highlighted. Is this it? That's not the one that you brought? Yeah. Okay, well I have then what I have what you brought. This is what you have highlighted.
That's not the one that he presented. I don't know which one that was. It was the 2000, I think it was the 2018 paper.
Yeah, you gave me five. Just, I mean, just pull them up.
Atmospheric lead and anartic ice during the last climactic cycle?
Yeah.
Is that it?
That's one of them. I don't think it's the one that Dibble presented.
But what are the ones that you're presenting?
The one that Manu sent me. Let's see what she's got.
See that one, I think it goes back 149,000 years. So yeah just
send it. Oh this is the one yeah this is the one I think that what date is on
that. I don't know 2018 maybe. 20 yeah I think it's 2018. Okay right. So it said the the title of this is for anybody
wants to find it is lead pollution recorded in Greenland ice indicates
European emissions track plagues wars and Imperial expansion
during antiquity. Right. Okay. Okay. So if you look up the other papers they
treat a different period of time and when you go back to the Ice Age, you do find the same kind of evidence.
Is that what this paper is showing?
This is, which one is, is this the same?
This is the one we were just looking at?
Oh no, this is that short time period.
So this is the-
1100 BC to 800-
This is the one that Dibble presented then?
Yeah. Okay, so what's the one that you're presenting? I'm not presenting this. Okay, but what is the one that Dibble presented that yeah okay so what's the
one that you're presenting I'm not presenting okay but what it was it was
the one that you're referencing the ones that I that was sent to me where are
those they're on they're in the folder Jamie and what is that one called okay
go down to the next one this one right for it says highlighted this is like the
high-lacing area yeah I mean okay I think they're all kind of similar. Yeah well
the first two, you sent me five things, the first two are the same it's
just this is highlighted. Oh I see, okay. Okay let's go that and make it a little
bigger. I sent them to you, they're on there as they were sent to me. So it
says very low during the Holocene era, probably during the last interglacial and
part of the last ice age.
They were very high during the last glacial maximum and at the end of the penultimate,
I love that word, penultimate.
I love that word, don't you?
It's a great word.
So the concentrations were high of lead during the ice age is saying yeah
So this does counter what he was saying
see, sir
Okay, but I'm not the expert I mean I I understand what you're saying, but this goes far
Far back but past when he was talking about. So the possibility could be that what Graham
was saying might actually have some weight to it, that there was a highly advanced civilization
before the Ice Age and that it went away. And then when you see lead in the future,
you're just seeing sort of a re-understanding of this process.
That's one way to put it.
That could be.
Yeah, and it doesn't have to be a really highly advanced civilization like ours.
It just means that there is industrial activity, whatever that shape or form that takes.
Well, the real fascinating thing is if the Egyptians had figured out how to generate power without any damage to the environment.
Which is really wild.
We haven't yet, have we?
No.
But if they figured that out with that Great Pyramid, if that process is how they generated
electricity, that's about as green as you're ever going to get.
Pretty amazing.
Yeah.
Here's a little factoid for you.
What? Do you know in 2021 they quarried enough coal by weight to build a pyramid 76 times bigger
than the Great Pyramid?
Wow.
Whoa.
So we know how to extract rock.
Yeah.
Right?
Yeah, collectively at least yeah yeah
especially in China right oh yeah which is hilarious very efficient they're not
not just that they're really good at making coal plants they're making they
have hundreds of new ones opening up yeah well we're over here freaking out
anything else before we get out of here Jamie you said that there was a couple
other slides you thought were really interesting
Okay, I'm really curious what that fan was all about but he described what yeah
There was one other thing I would like to address if you don't please. Okay. So the other thing that
The doctor dibble mentioned
Was when you raised the question about the core drilling.
Right.
Right?
And Dr. Dibble said that, well, that's been debunked.
I'm just paraphrasing now.
Okay.
That's been debunked.
And he referenced two sources. He referenced the scientists against myth and
world of antiquity. Okay.
So, scientists
this is where, you know, if you don't give it
enough information people will fill in the gaps. You know,
you leave a vacuum. Engineers are very well known for leaving all kinds of
vacuums they don't explain everything completely because they assume everybody
knows it because they know it right and so it's the simplest thing and
basically scientists against myth they they sent me their paper on the methods that they used
which contradicted my methods.
And what they did is they went to, they got these photographs, two-dimensional photographs
of the Petri Corps and they rejected the method that I used which was just a simple
string or cotton thread.
With magnification.
With magnification and with the artifact in my hand.
So you've got best evidence in your hand and against evidence secondhand with photographs.
So what's wrong?
What is the problem with that?
And when I saw what method they used, I didn't take it seriously.
Perhaps I should and then we won't be here talking about it.
But I didn't take it seriously and it's like it kind of
failed on its face just after the first two pages plus it was very insulting and
mocking right not very professional and but basically what they did is this they
took a 2d photograph of a 3d cone okay Okay, I want to show you two things. This is a flat
blank and this is a cone. Okay, so aerospace manufacturing engineers know
all about how cones are made and they know how to measure them and they know
how to transmit geometric data to the customer.
Our customers would never accept a 2D photograph of a 3D object as evidence of geometric accuracy or precision.
I mean a 3D camera with a scanner or something like that, but just a simple
two dimensional photo.
Two dimensional.
It won't work.
Right, too limited.
Too limited.
But what happens to the evidence when you take a 2D photograph?
I'll show you. You have a corruption of the evidence right away. What happens with a
2D photograph taking a 3D object? You can go through these series of cones that are made. This is a cone that has horizontal lines around it, right?
And you can see that they're horizontal. So you can assume, okay, you take a, I took a 2D photograph of that and then I brought it into my computer but
there are there are some things that happen to the arc length the arc length
on the original if you take a 2D photograph you are using the cord length as the arc length.
You got all that on camera Jimmy? Is it on both cameras?
The other one? Pick it up?
Okay, okay.
Right. But there's another problem with it and it's not just geometry.
Well it is ultimately is geometry but it's more involved with how the eye works and how a
camera functions, and that's the lens.
And basically, what you're doing is you're capturing an image of a cone, and if you focus focus your camera here, right? The lines here curve that way, the lines down here curve
this way. So you take those and you lay them out flat, you've got corrupted evidence. You project those images onto a cone in the computer and
this is what happens. You've got a bunch of wavy lines. Did you get that?
Which indicates that it's a spiral. No, it doesn't. This is not to
prove that it's a spiral. This is to prove that the evidence
that they have produced is not the best evidence.
Right, because it's only two-dimensional. To refute your evidence, they should look at
the thing, measure it, accurately scan it. But it also describes the state of mind of the investigators who are working on this.
And that is they are driving to a conclusion that is directly opposite to mine.
So they're not acting in good faith. If you read a scientific paper or if you are
working on a scientific project, if you're in school or if you're anywhere, and so you
prepare your report, you publish your report, you describe the methods that you use and the tools that you use, how
you did it, and then you publish your results.
I did that.
And then somebody comes along behind you and they say, well, I want to see that for myself.
That's what you call falsification process where, you know, a science has any theory
has to be falsifiable.
So somebody's, if they confide anything wrong with what you did, then, you know, they have
to follow the same steps you did right to the letter, right?
But they didn't do that. They didn't do that clearly and also they didn't have access to the actual physical object
It's it doesn't indicate that they did they were just the only way you could really tell they're just drawing down
Photographs from the internet so they were just trying to debunk it exactly and they were doing and what they're doing is silly, but
Exactly and they were doing and what they're doing is silly but
Then you have a college professor who scoops up all that research and and they become cited sources in their work Well, he probably was just respecting their work and thinking that your work is one of those alternative guys
That's not not a part of the system. Not a part of the academic system
Yeah, and yeah, and so he just yeah, and he obviously he works with seeds and things along those lines not a part of the system, not a part of the academic system. Yeah.
And so he just, and obviously he works with seeds and things along those lines, so that's
his area of archaeology, so he trusts the other experts.
Yeah, yeah, you know, I'm not saying that, I'm not saying that what he said is his own,
you know, invention.
Right, you're just saying that the sources are I'm just saying that I mean
He was he was certainly well-schooled and he had the answers to some of these mysteries, right?
And he had been given
information
and pretty much he
Reeled it out when the question was raised
The other thing that I thought of after the fact, and we actually kind of covered it,
but I never connected the dots, was that one of the things that we were talking about when
we were talking about Gobekli Tepe, that Gobekli Tepe was created by these people that didn't
need agriculture because the place they lived was so bountiful.
But what if they just didn't, what if agriculture to them wasn't
plants? What if agriculture was animal agriculture and they fed their animals with wild plants?
If the wild plants were in such abundance that they could just go out and chop down
the wild plants and use them to feed their animals, that's still agriculture, but it's
not, it's not plant agriculture.
Yeah, I don't, I, yeah.
So that's the difference.
I forgot that while it was happening,
and then afterwards I was like,
ah, why didn't I connect those dots?
Because go back to the tap,
no one is disputing the time period of it.
It's 11,000 years ago, right?
That's when it was covered intentionally, 11,000 years ago.
So no one's disputing that, but that puts it into the term of
Pre agriculture and so what he was saying was that maybe where they lived was so bountiful
With with food that they didn't need agriculture at the time
Possible, but also are we only thinking of agriculture as plant agriculture? And do we have to grow plants in an agricultural setting to feed animals?
Well, doesn't that entirely depend on how we're raising these animals?
Because if these animals are free-ranging and you have an enormous area, then no.
Then you could harvest them out free-ranging you could have
agriculture in terms of animals and you could have
These animals that you're farming you're just farming them with wild plants
And if you could do that for go back Lee Tepe, which is what they're saying
And at least they're saying that either they just hunted all the animals that were around there
There was so many animals around them. they could hunt them very easily to feed everybody
so they'd have enough resources to build this thing or maybe they had some kind
of agriculture in terms of animal agriculture but just hadn't planted
things yeah or hadn't had the need to plant things if they're living in such
abundance yeah I don't know I Don't know
It's a good question though. It is a good question. Yeah, all of it is good questions
All these good questions citizens coming forward and asking raising their hands and saying oh wait a minute
What about this? What about this? And that's what you've done and listen
I think you've done an amazing job of it and the way you explained it today. I really I
Really appreciate it.
It's great for a person like myself
to be able to ask a person like you questions
and get to the heart of how this whole thing would work.
And I think you laid it out amazingly.
It's such a fascinating subject.
And so many mysteries and so many questions.
And I just wanna thank you for putting in so much time
and having so much energy of your life dedicated to trying to figure this thing out.
Yeah, can I go take a nap now?
Yes, you can go take a nap. You did great. Tell everybody about your books though so they can get them.
So anyway, we've got the Giza Power Okay. Technologies of ancient Egypt.
And then the newest one.
The newest one.
Is, what does it say on that one?
Giza, the Tesla connection.
Can they see it from there?
Yeah, okay cool.
Giza, the Tesla connection.
Yep.
Alright, and those are available now.
Acoustical science and harvesting of clean energy.
Alright, well thank you sir.
I really appreciate you coming here.
I really enjoyed it.
Alright.
And you're do a great service
you you you should uh... give those to you on most
why he needs them
well if he's going to build electric cars is going to need electricity for
our alumna
alumna
alright thank you Thanks for watching!